When Brooklynites Megan & Ted decide to try to get pregnant around the beginning of the pandemic, they’re surprised to conceive immediately. After seeing an OB and desiring less rushed time and more holistic care, they eventually land on giving birth at Brooklyn Birthing Center with midwives and a doula. Megan’s taken aback and challenged when she experiences 3 days of prodromal early labor with very little sleep. Eventually, labor kicks into gear once her water breaks. After pushing for 3+ hours and being told she may need to transfer to the hospital, their doula smartly encourages Megan to try an asymmetrical position that helps the baby get past the pelvic brim and finally be born. Megan & Ted also share about how well-supported they were not only in labor but after birth, too, and how important that was when Megan experienced some baby blues, surfacing in temporary anxiety and uncharacteristic irritability.
Resources:
Raychel Franzen & Kori Krysh - doulas
Windi gaspasser*
And Baby Makes Three* by the Gottmans (and the Bringing Baby Home workshops)
Becoming Us: 8 Steps to Grow a Family that Thrives by Elly Taylor
The Fourth Trimester by Kimberly Ann Johnson.
Battery-operated tea lights* - great for setting ambience for labor
Sponsor links:
East River Doula Collective (find a doula, attend our free “Meet the Doulas” event)
Free “Pack for Your Best Birth” Packing List (with free mini-course option)
*Disclosure: Links on this page to products are affiliate links; I will receive a small commission on any products you purchase at no additional cost to you.
Episode Topics:
Getting pregnant very quickly after decided to try
Didn’t love initial OB, so started looking elsewhere
Found Brooklyn Birthing Center
Hiring doulas, taking birth class, seeing chiropractor, couples therapy
Being pregnant during a pandemic
Prodromal labor for 3 days -- using ball, lots of showers/baths, watching tv, checking in with doula regularly
Stopping work at 39 weeks
On the 3rd day, calls midwives -- they say to come in to be checked
They give her a shot to help her get some sleep as she hadn’t slept in a long time
Late that night, water broke with a trickle
By 10pm, things getting intense and doula comes over
They leave for the birthing center 11 or 12
She’s 6cm upon arrival
Doula advocates for them to change to a room with a tub
Using birth ball
Pushing in the tub, checking baby’s heart rate with doppler every 15 minutes
Pushing for a long time, trying lots of positions
Tried squatting stool, didn’t work for her
Moving to bed on hands and knees
Midwives started talking about transferring after 3.5 hrs
Raychel has her get into an asymmetrical all-fours/lunging position and this helped baby come out
They also earlier tried re-rupturing the membranes and emptying bladder with catheter
She’s born in all four with compound presentation
Nearly hemorrhaging, needing iron
Struggling with breastfeeding for around two days, using a nipple shield just for 2 days
Parents come to support them -- cooking, helping with dog, cleaning, holding Iris, etc.
First 2 weeks were tough -- feeling anxiety and irritable
Raychel comes by to support breastfeeding a couple of days after birth, extremely helpful
Milk comes in on day 3
Loving being a mom
Ted’s reflections on being a dad -- being a parent has been easier than they expected
Be sure to stagger support in postpartum
Get as much education as you can
Trusting that your body and baby know what it needs to do to give birth/be born
Take things moment by moment
Interview Transcript
Lisa: Welcome to The Birth Matters Podcast. Today I have with me Megan and Ted. Welcome.
Megan: Hi!
Ted: Thanks for having us.
Megan: Yeah, thank you!
Introductions
Lisa: Sure. It's so good to see you, and I can't wait to hear your birth story. Why don't you just go ahead and take a moment to introduce yourselves if you would.
Megan: Sure. So, I'm Megan.
This is my husband Ted, we live in Prospect Heights.
I'm a social worker at a hospital here in Brooklyn, and this is Iris. She was born February 18th at the Brooklyn Birthing Center.
Ted: Yeah, and maybe a little something else, Meg and I went to the same elementary, middle and high school, knew each other as kids and met on Tinder in our twenties.
Megan: Reconnected, yeah.
Ted: Reconnected in our twenties, so we've known each other our whole lives, but it started into our late 20s.
Lisa: That makes me want to do a series of love stories of finding out how the parents met and fell in love, and...
Megan: Yeah, it's a pretty wild story.
Parental Leave
Lisa: Well, great, thank you. And as you were mentioning your work, Megan, how much leave have you been able to take off? Have you returned already or--?
Megan: No, I'm pretty lucky with that actually, because my job offers like three months of partially-paid leave, and then you can take up to four years of unpaid childcare leave if you want.
So I'm picking an extra four months, for a total of like six to sevenish months, so I'll go back in September maybe. Yeah.
Lisa: Oh, I'm so glad you're able to do that.
Megan: It's really nice to have extra time to hang out with her.
Lisa: Yeah, too many people have to go back so soon. I mean, I even had what's considered a generous package with my employer and it was three months. And even then I was like, this feels too soon.
Megan: Yeah.
Lisa: Good, glad to hear that.
How the pregnancy went
Lisa: So why don't we start, can you share a little bit about how your pregnancy went and how you made different choices of care provider and doula and just all the different ways that you prepared for this journey into parenthood?
Megan: Well, first of all, we decided to start trying to get pregnant last April or May. And then we thought, oh, we'll have a couple of months to try and get ready for the baby. And then we ended up getting pregnant, like right away, which was really great.
So the first couple months were kind of tough. I just had a lot of nausea, and I was exhausted. Like I would come home from work and go to bed at like seven o'clock every night. And yeah, I don't know, just like a general feeling of uneasiness, just because of all the changes that my body was going through. But luckily, second trimester got a lot better, I had a lot of energy. So it was just the first two to three months that were kind of rough.
Switched initial OB-GYN
Megan: So we initially started going to appointments at an OB-GYN, like a local chain, really close to our apartment. We chose it because it was easy to get to, but we didn't love the doctor that we met with there.
So after maybe a month, we decided to start looking at other options and we really wanted somewhere that was going to take the time to answer questions and help us figure out a birth plan and really look at me as a whole person, I guess, rather than just trying to rush through everything. So it was hard, but we finally decided to try out Brooklyn Birthing Center. There's just so many options in New York, so it was hard to narrow it down to one.
Lisa: Although hardly any birthing center options.
Megan: Yeah, that's true.
Lisa: Many, many care providers, many, many hospitals, not many birthing centers.
Megan: Yeah, and I don't know if we had ever considered a birthing center before, but looking at their website and their reviews, it just seemed like a good place and the midwife seemed really cool. So we tried that out.
Where she heard about The Birthing Center?
Lisa: Do you remember asking where you originally heard about The Birthing Center? If you remember.
Megan: We just kind of Googled.
Lisa: Sure.
Megan: Yeah. Yeah, because we were new to New York, so didn't know that many people who had given birth there already, so we didn't really know who to turn to for a personal recommendation. So just a lot of Googling.
Ted: Yeah, it was all pretty overwhelming. So we got pregnant, super grateful, but we got pregnant really quickly. And then Megan didn't feel great in the first trimester. And then she hadn't been in New York that long, so she hadn't had long experience with our OB, and then come to find out as a pregnant person, she didn't like her OB quite as much, so then she had to started researching. And as she said, there's like 1,000,001 options. It was super overwhelming, at least for me, but Megan, just found it on the internet, I don't know, kind of impressive. Yeah, it was quite a stressful week of looking at different options, but we lucked out with settling at The Birthing Center.
And so I feel like they do a lot to really prepare people to give birth. So they required that we take a childbirth education class, that we took with you. And also a separate breastfeeding class, it was all over Zoom. And then they also strongly recommended getting a doula. I hadn't really thought too much about getting a doula, I thought, oh, it'd probably be fine. But since they certainly recommended it, in the last couple of weeks, we finally got a doula pair through then NYC Doula Collective. Rachyl Franzen and Kori Krysh.
Lisa: They've been praised several times on the podcast and I refer folks to them all the time.
Megan: Yeah, they were really awesome. And Raychel ended up attending the birth it just depended who was available, but yeah, she was really wonderful. And then in terms of other stuff that I did to prepare, I did do a lot of prenatal yoga videos on YouTube and I saw a chiropractor, The Flower of Life in Park Slope. They were great. And I feel like I tried to stay on top of exercising through the second trimester. And then by the third one, I was just so big and tired and my feet hurt all the time, so I wasn't so good in the last couple of months, but it turned out fine.
Why chiropractor?
Lisa: And with going to Flower of Life, what prompted you to even think about seeking that out?
Do you remember?
Megan: Yeah, well, I guess I've always seen a chiropractor since I was a teenager, because I've always had someback pain and neck pain, so I was seeing someone who didn't specialize in pregnancy for the first couple of months, and then as I got closer to the birth, I decided I wanted to see someone who did, so that they could maybe help with just making sure everything was in alignment and prepared as much as possible. So there wasn't anything in particular wrong or it wasn't really recommended by the midwife or anything, I just decided to try it and see if it helped.
I wish every pregnant person could have chiropractic, you know, especially with someone who specializes in this time of life, because this is a whole musculoskeletal event between two people, you know, and to try if we can, to ensure that our alignment is good and that things are just so, it's going to really help things go better. Or tend to, anyway. Yeah. Nice.
Megan: Yeah.
Ted: We got lucky, because I think really we wouldn't have picked a doula if it wasn't for The Birthing Center. So The Birthing Center sends us to the doula, and then the doula sent us, I think, to Flower of Life, specifically. They recommended [them]. So it was like, we just sort of popped on this lucky sort of program that matched what we wanted.
Yeah, I love that. Often midwives, doulas, childbirth educators can be a great resource for customizing resources. Assessing your needs and your personality and your desires, and really providing some people who specialize in this time of life, you know, who can really optimally serve you.
Lisa: That's great. So then was there any, whenever you're ready, feel free to, if you think of other things prenatally, but then, yeah, feel free to jump into your birth story whenever you're ready.
Pregnant during the pandemic
Megan: Okay. Well actually I forgot to talk about being pregnant during the pandemic. So I was working in the whole pregnancy in a hospital, so it was pretty stressful being pregnant and being scared every day that I was going to catch COVID. But luckily, I didn't. And I think since it was a hospital, they probably had better PPE practices than other places, so maybe that protected me more. And I think even though it was kind of scary going in to work every day while pregnant and seeing patients, it was also nice to still get some social interaction while I was pregnant.
Lisa: Because my coworkers threw a baby shower and I still got to talk to other people every day instead of just being cooped up at home. So, a good and a bad side. Oh.
Megan: And I also feel very fortunate, I got access to the vaccine pretty early on. So I actually got it in January when I was still pregnant.
I was eight months pregnant and I was nervous about that decision because everything was sort of up in the air with pregnant people at that time. But now the studies are coming out saying like, it's safe, I'm really glad that I got it.
Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. So we're recording this in May, and I just saw an article this week in The New York Times about new research coming out. We knew through breast milk, that babies were getting antibodies, but there's more research now coming out that you might've seen that's saying, in pregnancy, they're getting it through the bloodstream, and so that's really nice.
Lisa: I was thinking so you found out you were pregnant April, May last year?
I guess it was the very beginning of June.
Lisa: Okay. Okay. Yeah, I was thinking about the beginning of your pregnancy, but you don't know it immediately. Yeah. So I was back when lockdown was more serious, right. A lot more strict, but you were having to go in the hospital.
Ted: Actually, you know, on a "light" note, it was also during the killing of George Floyd. That was the height of the demonstrations with killing of George Floyd, so we lived in Brooklyn, actually, where a lot of the action was. So, you know, it was just a lot going on, you know, much worry for everybody, including Megan at that time.
Yeah.
Self-care to de-stress
Lisa: Yeah, were there specific things Megan, or either of you, [that you] were doing for self-care to de-stress?
Well, we did go to some protests,otherwise.
Couples therapy
Ted: Couples therapy.
Megan: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I forgot. No, we didn't start till a few months later.
Ted: We started talking about couples therapy.
Megan: Yeah. Actually, we started couples therapy like last fall and it was really helpful for just like strengthening communication before the baby came and, yeah, just working on getting ourselves ready.
Lisa: That's such an important way that most people don't think about, you know, way to prepare for this journey into parenthood.
I'm so glad to hear that you did that. I think only one other, maybe one other person on the podcast has shared about seeking out therapy before baby was born. Good, yeah, because you don't want to wait until, I mean, not that I know what the state of your relationship was at that point, but I mean, so many people wait until it's too far gone, you know, to seek out therapy. And so I love it when I see people really be proactive on that.
Yeah.
Megan: Yeah, and then is there anything else that we did? Not really. Yeah.
Lisa: Great, well then you can start your birth story wherever you want. It could be the weeks leading up to, wherever or right when things started, wherever you like.
Megan: Okay.
So I feel like it's a long story.
The birth story: Prodromal labor
Lisa: I know you've had days long of early labor, right?
Megan: Yeah.
Lisa: We call it prodromal labor.
Megan: I know, I wasn't very familiar with that before I got it. And I was unhappily surprised.
Lisa: That's where my phrase "huge range of normal" in class that I keep saying, it's hard. It's hard to like figure out in our time together, what do I cram in? You know? Maybe I should mention prodromal labor, you could be in early labor for days, so that it's not as jarring when it happens to you.
Megan: Yeah. Yeah. The midwives actually said something like that. She said it's not usual, but it is normal. So I guess it's another way of saying big range of normal, but, yeah. So she was born exactly 41 weeks. So, that was a Thursday.
Contractions and the app
Megan: So that Sunday night at like 11 o'clock, my contractions started, so I was really excited. I was thinking, okay, maybe like within 24 hours baby was going to be here.
Ted: And I had a contraction, checked the app but the app wasn't that helpful for me because the contractions would get really intense and the app would say, okay, it's time to go to the hospital and then they would go away. Because the app told us to go to the hospital; the midwife would ask actually human-specific questions, right? Like not be an app, and no, you got to wait it out so it was kind of like a stop-and-go sort of thing.
Megan: Yeah.
Maybe I'll clarify, when I say download an app and say, don't download the one that tells you to go in the hospital, because that can be confusing. That's interesting.
Megan: Yeah, I think it's like once they're like every three minutes or something, it's just tells you maybe it's time to start going.
But yeah, so the contractions would get really intense and be like three or five minutes apart or whatever. And then they would calm down and be like 10 or 15 minutes apart. And I would try to like nap in between, but that got harder and harder as the days went on, because it just got like slowly more intense each day.
So through that time, I talked to the doula Raychel a lot, because she would be like, "Okay, has your water broken? How do you feel? What about the mucus plug and stuff like that?"
Megan: So she always recommended maybe wait, because it doesn't seem like it's time yet. And she was right. So through that time I just took a lot of baths and a lot of showers and sat on the ball and just kind of tried to walk around and watch TV to take my mind off what was going on.
Lisa: And so actually, luckily, I took off work at 39 weeks, so I figured I could have a good week to, if she came on time, and I have a good week to finish organizing the baby's room and rest and all that. And I did, so I'm really glad that I had that week to just take to myself and prepare, because then the next week, it was just all contractions and I wasn't really able to do much of anything. That must have played such mind games with you.
Megan: Yeah, it did.
Lisa: Did you keep feeling like, is this labor, is this not? Or how in the world did you deal with that [psychologically]? I mean, it sounds like you were trying to find ways to take your mind off of it, yeah, but were there other things that helped you?
Yeah, it was really hard to not know exactly what was happening or when she was going to come. But I guess I just tried to remind myself of the stuff we learned in your class, about how the baby's going to come when they're ready. And Raychel told me, you know, maybe your body is having these days of contractions for a reason.
Megan: Like maybe there's something that your body knows that you don't know, it's working to get you ready.
Lisa: So having you reframe things? Yeah, reframing is a good word. Just giving me a different perspective on it. Because then I could sort of appreciate what was happening a little more instead of just being like, why is this happening to me?
Compound presentation
And I think she was right, because actually, when Iris was born her arm was like by her head.
Lisa: Compound presentation, interesting.
Megan: Yeah, and she came out with her hands, like up by her head, somaybe my body was like trying to move her arm, but it didn't really work out, so I don't know. Yeah, and just trying to take it minute by minute, just like be in the moment, that helped. Yeah.
Lisa: And Ted, during these days of prodromal labor, were you working? What was going on for you?
Ted: Yeah. I was working, I was working from home, where we're sitting right now and Megan was bouncing on the ball and having contractions five feet away from me, while I was working, you know. And my coworkers obviously knew her due date was the Thursday before Iris was born, so they were sort of on notice all week. But yeah, I was working in trying to support my wife. Thanks goodness for the doulas and all the education that we had from the classes.
Megan: Yeah. And I would let Teddy know what was going on, and during the nights I actually woke him up, I think maybe twice. I'd be like, I think this might be it, and then it wasn't. So the night that it actually was time, I didn't wake him up, because I was like, I don't think, I don't know what's really happening. Like I'll just let him sleep.
Lisa: You're giving up, you're like this is never going to happen so, let him sleep!
Megan: Yeah.
Ted: It was like a few nights in a row where I'd hear Megan like whispering on the phone from another room of the apartment. And she was like calling the doula and checking in. I would wake up and in a panic because, you know, at any moment I thought we were ready to go.
Megan: Yeah. So I guess that was kind of it for the first three days. And then on that third day, I did call the midwife at The Birthing Center and they said, "why don't you just come in and we'll check you out, see what's going on?" And so that was Wednesday. And when I got there, nothing was really happening.
I think they could measure the contractions and see that they were happening, but I think I was I don't know, like not dilated at all and maybe like 20% effaced or something.
Yeah.
Lisa: It's probably not what you wanted to hear, I'm guessing.
Ted: No, that was pretty frustrating. She wasn't sleeping for four nights, four days, So we were actually starting to get worried about her,
Lisa: Yeah. So they gave me Promethazine, I think. She said it was like a shot of Benadryl sort of, so it helped me sleep for like four or five hours, that night, which was really helpful, because at that point, I wasn't really able to sleep through the contractions much at all. And then luckily that night, late Wednesday night, I think it was like midnight, my water broke. I guess partially because the rest of it broke during labor. When you say partially, do you just mean it was like a trickle or?
Megan: Yeah, it was like a tickle. So at that point, well, the doula, Raychel recommended, "Okay, let's wait and see how it goes." So I was just taking it easy that night and just in the bed by myself all night until six in the morning when Teddy was up. And then by 10, it was starting to get really intense and I felt like it was finally time.
So, the doula came over, we went to The Birthing Center around maybe 11 or 12:00 PM, and at that point I was like six centimeters dilated.
Lisa: Finally, right?
Megan: Yeah.
Admitted to birthing center
Megan: Yeah. So I guess it all happened like that, in those early morning hours. So they admitted me and I was all set up in a room with a big tub.
Lisa: Yay for the tub!
Megan: Yeah.
Ted: Actually we went in a room without a tub and the doula advocated that we switched to one with a tub when it became available. And they said, well, the cleaners have to come and everything else, but she pressed it and we got room with a tub, and it was very helpful.
Lisa: Good, good. Little pushing goes a long way.
Ted: Some fake candles and put on some music and all this sort of stuff that we had picked up from the class and speaking with the doula to sort of make it more comfortable and that sort of stuff. That was sort of the first thing we did, we settled in.
Megan: Yeah. We ordered a lot of stuff from your Amazon shopping list.
Yeah. I love the little candles, that was really nice to have. Yeah, so after we were admitted, it was just kind of like hanging out for a couple of hours until the real action started. It was just me, Teddy and Raychel for a while, and they were feeding me snacks and Gatorade and stuff, so I could keep my energy up.
And I was just hanging out in the tub and bouncing on the ball. They have balls there.
Time to start pushing
Megan: And then finally, when it felt like it was time to start pushing, the midwives got a lot more involved. So they would check my heart rate pretty often, and then also the baby's heart rate. And I guess it was like every 10 to 15 minutes, but it was hard to tell time at that point. So I'm not really sure how often.
Lisa: Yeah, they're usually going to check a lot more frequently in the pushing stage. Yeah, usually around 15 minutes or so.
Megan: Okay. The first part of pushing, I tried in the tub, like in squatting and on hands and knees, and then after maybe two hours, when it felt like we weren't really getting anywhere, I tried some other positions. Raychel thinks that maybe, I don't know, the midwife said I was technically pushing for three and a half hours, but I think I had like a unique pushing experience, because I had a lot of breaks in between the contractions, like seven minutes. I don't know if that's normal. So, so it wasn't like constant, I had some breaks through that.
Lisa: Sure. Yeah, there's definitely such a huge range of normal and including with this. And it makes sense that there's so many different variables that can play into how long the pushing stage takes, such as what you just said, big breaks in between. You're going to have fewer opportunities, or if the contractions happen to be on the weaker side, they're not as powerful or how high is the baby in the pelvis or what is the position of the baby? You know, there's a lot, and the compound position could affect the length of it as well. So, yeah. But I'm glad you were getting some breaks to recuperate in between the exertion.
Megan: That was really helpful. Yeah, so after the bath, they brought out like a squatting chair, but it didn't work for me at all. It was just like too wide, and I don't know.
Then I think we moved to the bed at that point, and I tried on hands and knees, because that felt like what I needed to do at that point. And so this is when the midwives were like, "okay, it's been a while. It might be time to start thinking about transferring you to the hospital." This was like three and half hours.
Lisa: And even though everything was okay, they were a little worried that they might be getting stuck, because she had been in the -1 station, I think for a while. Pretty high.
Megan: Yeah. But luckily Raychelrecommended that I be on hands and knees in like a lunge position, because she said that the asymmetry can sometimes help get the baby's head, like over the pubic bone or whatever.
Lisa: Absolutely.
Rest of water broke
Megan: And she And she was right, because I think I pushed in that position for like three times and it was really exhausting. It's really not a comfortable position when you're in labor, but it worked, and so the rest of my water broke at that point. So like in the middle they noticed that part of my water was still intact and they tried to break it.
Lisa: Yeah. The amnio-hook probably.
Megan: Yeah. And also they did a catheter because they thought maybe my bladder was full and blocking things, but I don't know. I don't know if that really helped all that much.
Ted: Yeah, that was making me a little anxious because I know that introducing things might add bacteria or whatever. The amount of intervention that we have to do increases the risk of what happens.
Yeah, they were trying different methods to see if it would help, which was great, but they were unsuccessful and I'm like, all right, well, we're doing things unsuccessfully that introduce bacteria. And it had been quite a while, and so, yeah, so I was even more anxious again.
Were those things being done, trying to rupture the membranes artificially and the emptying the bladder with a catheter, it sounds like maybe that was before the asymmetrical position that you did?
Megan: Yeah, that was maybe like two hours in, when they were trying to figure out what might be delaying it.
Yeah, so that was at like two hours, yeah. Those were the things they tried and just trying to move things along, but I don't know if they helped too much.
She was out!
Megan: So the asymmetrical lunge position, so my water broke and then I was really tired in that position, so I moved back onto like regular hands and knees, and I think one push later, they could see her head and the next push after that, she was out.
So she ended up coming out really fast after the water broke and everything started moving. I think everyone in the room was just kind of surprised.
Lisa: Yeah, because it sounded like they were about to start making arrangements for transferring. Did you feel like, did that give you an extra wind of energy to be like, no, I'm going to push this baby out at all or not really?
Megan: I think so, because at that point I was just so tired and I was like, I'll be fine if I have to go to the hospital, then I have to go, but I don't want to, I just want to get this baby out and sleep and rest. And I didn't want to have to go through a whole other admission process and then like maybe a C-section if that's what ended up happening, and all of that.
So maybe, maybe Iris heard it and was like, I'm going to come out now.
Lisa: She went, no, wait, wait, wait!
Megan: Yeah. And you said you were watching the midwives faces.
Ted: Oh yeah, yeah. So Megan was on hands and knees pushing, trying to give birth doggy style. The midwives are all behind her, ready to catch. And they were tired. I mean, you know, everybody looked pretty tired, even the midwives were mostly tired. Yeah, then their eyes lit up, right? So I'm in front of Megan, I could see Megan's face, she's right in front of me and I can look around and see the midwife's face, the midwives' faces, andyeah, I just so their eyes light up. So then I went to Megan and obviously she was in another place, right? And the next thing you know, we had our daughter.
Lisa: So, just to clarify real quick, when you said you did the asymmetrical position, it sounded like maybe you eventually went back to hands and knees after that, after getting her kind of over the pelvic brim, then you went back to all fours. Yeah. Okay.
Megan: Yeah. Yeah.
Lisa: And so when she came out, you said she had her arm over her head?
Megan: Yeah. I didn't see it obviously, but that's what they say. And every time we did an ultrasound, that's the position she was in, so I think that was just her favorite position.
Lisa: Oh, interesting. And then was it like a little football punt when she was born to hand her to you? Or, do you remember how that was navigated?
Megan: Yeah, it was like a football punt, it's a good way to describe it. Yeah, they just handed her to me right away and, I was kind of shocked because it happened so fast at that point.
Lisa: That's so strange how it can take days and days and days and days, that's a long time coming, but then when it happens, it's like, whoa, this feels sudden!
Megan: Yeah.
Lisa: Almost every birth story I hear, there's that sentiment, no matter the length of the labor. So interesting.
After-birth care
Megan: Yeah. So we did skin to skin right away and we did delayed cord clamping until it dried out. And then Teddy was able to cut the cord and then, oh, I had second-degree tear, so they had to stitch me up after that.
Lisa: It's pretty impressive that it was second and not like third or fourth, given the compound presentation.
Megan: Oh, really? Oh good, I'm glad. Yeah.
Ted: I think it's interesting too, that you were told what degree, because in most hospital settings, nobody ever tells you what degree you had. And I feel like people should know that even if it's not, maybe don't tell them right when it happens, because that might be scary possibly, but, or just like not remembered. But you know, at least at the six-week visit or before you go home from your birthplace, I think birthing people deserve to know what happened to their bodies and where the tear was and everything. They recommended that Megan take iron, and they told her how many CCs of blood she lost and, you know. I didn't know that it was a non-standard experience, that was really helpful for us.
Megan: Yeah, they said I came kind of close to hemorrhage.
Lisa: When you said she needed to take iron, I thought, you must've lost quite a bit of blood.
Megan: Yeah.
Yeah. Since obviously I was at a birthing center, I didn't have an epidural, like a localized painkiller to do that. And afterwards I guess I was in a little bit of shock because that was a long labor and the blood loss, so I was pretty shaky but luckily they just let us hang out with Iris and we brought some lentil soup and snacks. So Teddy was spoonfeeding me lentil soup while I was holding her.
Lisa: I love lentils. That's iron-rich, so that's great.
Megan: Yeah, that wasn't why I brought it. I just like the soup, I like making it, but it worked out.
Ted: Iron-rich foods with Megan's parents after Iris was born, we were sitting around and it was, you know, spinach and lentils and we're like, well, okay, we've been eating that for four days. Got lucky on that.
Lisa: Nice. And I like it, it's a warming food too. Because you want to replenish that body heat that you lose in birth, so perfect.
Ted: It was a cold, cold day. Yeah.
Went home early in the AM
Megan: Yeah, it was during like a snow / ice storm. So actually the next day, so they didn't keep us there very long. So Iris was born around 8:30 and then we went home around 5 in the morning.
Lisa: That early, oh my!
Ted: The midwives warned us that we may need to transfer to a hospital at 8:05 PM, and Megan gave birth at 8:20 PM, and then we left at I think, 4:15 AM. So it was just like such a whirlwind kind of thing there.
Lisa: Yeah, and it is standard with birthing centers to do early discharge, but I'm a little surprised that you had to go home that early in the morning. I would've thought they would've given you a couple more hours.
Megan: I think that standard is like six hours, and so they did give us a little bit of extra time, but yeah, at that point I think we were ready to go home, because we were both so tired. And there wasn't a good space for Iris to sleep there, so we were ready to get home and take a nap, clean ourselves up. Megan slept for about 15 minutes between 8:30 PM and 4:00 AM when we left. So Megan still didn't sleep. She didn't sleep for four days leading up to the birth and then she didn't sleep after the birth, and at the birthing center. So we were ready to get some sleep.
Lisa: Seriously, that, oh, that's a lot, oh my goodness!
Ted: Yeah, pretty exhausted. But I think after the birth, I did have a lot of adrenaline. So the next day I was really hyped up and then the second day after that is when I crashed and just needed to zone out and sleep. There was also just a lot to do in those hours. So they tried to get Iris to latch and it didn't really work out initially. I don't know, it was all kind of a blur because I was so tired. Yeah they're showing us the placenta, and then they're trying to get Iris to latch and then they're asking questions about documents for the birth certificate. So I ended up using a nipple shield for like two days after the birth. And I think that really helped Iris strengthen her latching. So then after that, I didn't have any issues, luckily with breastfeeding. But the first couple of days were really hard, just trying to figure it out and be like, is she getting enough food?
Lisa: Sure.
Megan: But yeah, I feel really fortunate that we did do The Birthing Center, because I think if we had been in a hospital setting, they probably wouldn't have let me go so long with the early prodromal labor and the pushing, and obviously like, everything was fine, we were both healthy, There was no need to rush things along. So I'm glad that we were somewhere that gave us that space to let Iris come naturally. And they were awesome, I really love the midwife, Makeda at the birthing center, she was great. She was the main person who attended our birth. Yeah.
Getting home
So do you want to talk at all about once you got home and getting to know Iris and any of that?
Megan: Yeah, so we got home and luckily, my parents came up the first week after the birth. So we got home that morning, really early, and then my parents were there by early afternoon to help out. I'm so appreciative of, because they were taking care of everything around the house, like cooking and bring me meals while I was in bed breastfeeding, or just trying to rest, and walking the dog and stuff like that.
And yeah, they just held Iris a lot, so I could feed her and then I could pass out and they would take the baby, and I wouldn't have to worry about it.
The first two weeks
Megan: So the first two weeks, I guess, were the hardest. So my parents were there the first week and then Teddy's mom was in the second week.
But I did have some baby blues, I wasn't, I wasn't sad, but I was anxious about Iris' safety and I was very irritable. It was weird, I'm not a very irritable person, I don't think, but for some reason, little things like Teddy or my parents were doing, or whoever was doing, would just make me angry for no reason.
So I knew that was all the hormones because I really appreciate all the help that we got.
Ted: I kind of liked it though, Megan reminded me of like a grouchy mama Grizzly bear or something. She's not messing around when it came to her daughter and whether I agreed or disagreed, I respected the heck out of it.
Lisa: Oh, what a nice partner perspective.
Megan: Yeah. The first couple of weeks are just so like anxiety-filled, just trying to figure out, am I doing things right? Is she sleeping in the right way, is she safe, all that.
And then.
Breastfeeding hurdles
Breastfeeding the first couple of days. That was a big deal.
Megan: Yeah. So, Raychel came by like two days after the birth, and just helped me figure out breastfeeding more, which was really valuable because, it was extremely helpful to have someone come in person and show you, just try over and over again, latches to make sure that you get it right, and set you up for success, so you don't have pain and issues later on. So at that point, I was having a hard time and I could only really feed her in the laying down position, that was the only way that worked.
Lisa: Like lying down on your side or your back or what?
Megan: On my side.
Lisa: Mmhmm.
Yeah, we did only that for a couple of days and we just worked on getting that one right, and then finally, we graduated.
Lisa: And that's such a, I mean, I'm glad that that worked well for you. Not everybody is ever able to get that down the side lying, but it's so restful for those overnight feeds to be able to feed lying just in a reclined position.
Megan: Yeah, I still do that for the night feeds. So I highly recommend having a doula help out with that, or if you don't have that, getting the lactation specialist. It's someone who can come in person if possible, now that the pandemic sort of subsided, yeah, I think that was the lifesaver.
Ted: Yeah. I mean, we already felt so connected to the doulas.
We already trusted her and respected her and she showed up and Megan and the doula and I just went into a room for two and a half, three hours and they came out experts with breastfeeding. It was just like, it was just such a great, great experience. That's so encouraging, we need that support. I wish it would become standard to have a home visit, you know, from a doula or lactation consultant. So you said that was a couple of days after birth or after you came home?
Megan: Yeah. That was two days after.
So had your milk come in by then, or was it still colostrum?
Megan: No, my milk came in the next day. So at that point it was still colostrum.
Lisa: And did you find that there were any new challenges once your breasts were more full with feeding?
Megan: Yeah, that was just a really uncomfortable day, just to wait and just keep feeding until that fullness goes away. I guess that did sorta change the latching a little bit, because like if you're over full, it's hard to get her to latch also, so that added a slightly new challenge, but I don't know, otherwise I don't think it changed it too much then. Yeah.
Lisa: And so with that additional bit of challenge, did Raychel come over any more? Usually with a birth doula, the package just includes one postpartum visit, but every doula's slightly different on that, and what they'll offer. Or was there phone support or did you not really need it after that initial visit that she came for?
Yeah, it was just one visit afterwards, and then after that, I don't think I needed another in-person visit. But she did provide a lot of text support. So she checked in probably every day or every other day to see how I was doing emotionally, and then how breastfeeding was going, and she answered a lot of random questions that I had about breastfeeding anxieties, and gave us a lot of resources. Yeah.
Ted: Yeah, they mentioned when we interviewed with them that day also one I guess in-home visit before the birth, one in-home visit after the birth, but to be frank, they said, call us, call us when the kid's five years old, call us, just give us a call. You know, that was really nice.
Megan: Yeah. It was helpful to have someone checking in on my emotional state also. Yeah. Teddy was really helpful for that and heard me, I don't know vent and cry and, hormonal roller coaster, but it's helpful to have like an outside person also.
Lisa: Absolutely. And did you find that the anxiety was just very temporary or has it continued?
Megan: No, I think it was pretty temporary. The first few weeks were the worst and then it sort of tapered off over the month. And I think a lot of it was maybe also just from sleep deprivation too, not being able to think as clearly and regulate emotions as well, when I was exhausted.
The second you said you were irritable, I was like, who wouldn't be if they hadn't slept for days and gave birth?
Megan: Yeah. But it's been a lot better, I've been feeling good and really enjoying being a mom. I think I like it more than I thought I would. I guess I was never that really into babies before, but she's a sweetie and it's been fun to see her smile and learn new skills. It was actually, so the first couple of weeks after she was born, since she's so brand new and her digestive system isn't working well, she would just scream every time she had to poop or fart.
And once she figured that out, I was so proud. It was just really, really cool, seeing a little tiny being grow and seeing her body adjust to being out in the world instead of, yeah, in my belly.
Soothing tips and tricks
Lisa: Are there any specific tips or tricks you have found helpful with regard to soothing her, whenever her basic needs have been met?
Ted: Did you recommend Windi? Was that from you?
Lisa: No, I don't think I did, but I know about it, yeah.
When Megan mentioned the screaming, that was really helpful for some of those nights.
Lisa: Good to know.
Megan: Yeah, that was really helpful. And then, I think that one night was really rough, so it was just crying and we didn't know what was going on. Maybe when she was like two weeks old, so I Googled how to soothe babies and learned about the five S-es, like shushing them, swinging.
Lisa: Yeah, we went through that very briefly in class.
Yeah, so that's been helpful. We started using those like swaddling, and we offered a pacifier at four weeks.
Singing
Ted: She really liked singing and neither Megan or I were very good singers, it was really funny, and we have bad memories for song lyrics. So it's just, we've been like a crash course in singing the last three months. We're remembering songs that our moms sang to us and stuff like that, it's been really fun and we were sharing songs that our moms sang to us, that the other of us didn't know, you know, it's been kind of fun. We didn't expect that.
Lisa: Aww, that's so fun. I was just listening to a podcast episode this morning, Mamas in Training, and they were talking about how much your baby loves your voice and singing to them. Even if you don't think you're a good singer, is magical for your baby, you know, they just love your voice. So just sing, don't even worry about what it sounds like to anybody else, because your daughter thinks it's perfect.
Love that.
Yeah. And as she's growing and as you start to find these rhythms and these,why am I not thinking of the right word, not patterns, but babies thrive in structure and routine. There's the word I was looking for. As you find these routines, as she's growing and that becomes more of a thing and more important, that singing, like singing at specific times, you know, as part of the bedtime routine can be so helpful, because it really cues to your baby, much more powerfully than like saying a certain phrase every time, that it's time to go to sleep, you know, just like reading a certain book might also cue that. But I love that you brought up singing. That's so cool.
Megan: Yeah. We've been trying that and I think it was helpful, we like Goodnight Moon every night and then I'll sing Rock-a-bye baby. I don't know, that was the first thing that came to my mind, like a couple of weeks ago, and she seems to like it. And so that with swinging, it seems to help a lot with getting her to sleep.
Lisa: Love it. I was frustrated one night, not long ago, because I couldn't get Iris to go to sleep, and I was singing the wrong song. Megan's like, when worst comes to worst Rock-a-bye baby is the one. And I was like kinda angry, I was like, no way. And then it worked. And right now, I'm singing Rock-a-bye baby most of the time these days.
Final Thoughts
Lisa: Yeah, those rituals are powerful really. Well, as we start to wind things down, are there any things that you haven't gotten to share that you were hoping to share and/or do you have any more insights or tips you'd like to share for those who are on a similar journey into parenthood?
Megan: Yeah. Did we cover everything? We said a lot.
Lisa: Well, and Ted, I don't know if you would like to reflect at all on what this metamorphosis into fatherhood has been like for you. Any specific things about the moments of meeting your daughter or anything since then, or this identity shift, anything to note?
Ted: Yeah. I mean, there should be.
Lisa: It's okay if you're still too sleep deprived to be able to identify it.
Ted: I was very excited and very ready to be a father. So I was super excited, which probably turned into anxiety. I was worried about my daughter and wife. But yeah, I was just so excited to be a father. My dad passed away right before Megan and I got married.
So, you know, I miss that, not having him around and not sharing that with him, but now I get to be a father, you know, I don't have him so I can add another father to the Veenstra repertoire. It has to be me, so it kind of felt like it was a shift in terms of being a bit more responsible and a bit less, you know, fun-loving and things like that. Just sort of a basic stuff of it.
And in terms of what it's like to be a father, it's exactly, Megan and I everyday just keep looking at each other like, this is so much easier and more fun and amazing than we ever thought.
Like, Megan actually said a couple of days ago, she said, I wouldn't have had kids earlier if I had known it was this amazing. So we're both kind of like over the moon right now, maybe that will change, as like as we progress or something. But for us, it's just been like ever since Iris was born and we got home in that snow storm, we've just been just so excited and it's just been a bit easy in that regard, so.
No, That's beautiful, and it's so encouraging to hear a story where both parents feel like this isn't as hard as we thought it was going to be, because that's not usually what you hear, you know? So, it's really refreshing to hear that. Particularly after you had days long labor, that could have felt really hard, and I'm sure it did feel hard, in the initial days and weeks after. But overall, to hear this perspective, just three months in is really encouraging.
Well, people in our lives just warned us over and over like, oh, it's going to be really hard. So we were prepared for the absolute worst, yeah, I don't know.
Megan: I think we got lucky. And also having a lot of support is so important. Yeah, I needed a lot of recovery time afterwards and Teddy was so helpful and having family come in, stay and take care of all non baby-related things, was really important I think for my recovery and for Teddy and I bonding with Iris in the first couple of weeks.
And actually, one thing I might recommend is, so he's working from home and I'm home with Iris right now. So we're all here, but he had two weeks off of paternity leave, and so the parents left, after two weeks, and he went back to work.
Megan: So like week three was actually really hard because it was busy week for him at work, and it was my first time really being alone with the baby. So I guess I would recommend if you can, try to have some help, like if one partner is going back to work kind of early, have some help during that time for a couple of days, at least.
Lisa: Yeah.
Megan: That would have been, yeah, that would have been helpful.
Lisa: Maybe staggering support.
Megan: Yeah. And then other advice, I guess it was just try to get as much education as you can. So I found it really helpful to know exactly what was happening when I was in labor, like what station the baby was at and the different interventions they might offer. So nothing was a surprise, I guess.
So education and then just trusting that your body and your baby know what it needs to do, to get them out.
And yeah, just trying to take things moment by moment and day by day and not get ahead of yourself. Because as everyone says, baby will just come when they're ready, so you just have to be patient and sort of let go of any control or expectations.
Megan: I guess also, maybe one of the last things, it's been a unique experience to be on maternity leave and have Teddy working from home because his job normally wouldn't be from home, but he's had more time to check in with me and Iris during the day and bond with her a little more and, sometimes he'll watch her while I would grab a shower or something if I've been overwhelmed that day and haven't gotten a chance to eat or take care of my needs.
So it's been a unique experience during the pandemic.
Lisa: And Ted, are you going to have to go back to work soon, to the office?
Ted: I think so, yeah. I probably will not have the option to work from home again, so I'm just really grateful, really cherish this time. I mean, I'm working, I hang up the phone and I hear Megan reading a book to Iris in the back room. It's like, it's the best, yeah. I'm really grateful for it.
Lisa: One of those silver linings. Well, thank you so much, it's been lovely to reconnect with you and thanks for taking the time, pretty soon after birth to share all of this.
Megan: Yeah, thank you, and thanks for everything you do. Your class was so important for getting us ready. So yes, I appreciate it.
Ted: Yeah, we spent so much time on video conference with you. I felt like we had already met you in person. It really feels like it at this point, but yeah, thanks for the education.
Thanks for putting it in bites that I could digest, right? I mean, for the class and everything else, and exactly like Megan said, with the station, what station's baby's in during birth and pushing and so on. I mean, it alleviated a lot of my stress and fears just to have the information in my head that you gave us. Whether I recalled it, and whether I can recall it right now, maybe not, but I felt better going in. So that's, I don't mean you can't quantify that thank you for that, for Megan's sake.
Lisa: It's my pleasure and my joy. All right, well, it's a beautiful day out, so I hope you can get a little bit of the sunshine and look forward to staying in touch. Take care.
Megan: Yeah, you too.
Lisa: Bye.